The Big Tech Show
00:09:58 · Adrian Weckler, Nik Storonsky
[00:09:58] S1: And who needs a blue check mark? Interesting. I'm over here in the Web Summit in Lisbon, and I did get a chance to sit down with Revolut's cofounder and CEO, Nik Storonsky, to talk about the future of the app and what it might do in Ireland. And this is how the conversation went. Nik, Revolut has over 2,000,000 Irish users, which makes Ireland, I think, its joint second biggest market after The UK. I want to talk to you about that, your mission to become maybe a financial super app, and a number of other things. But first, just before we get to all that, I want to ask you about a report earlier this week about you renouncing your Russian citizenship. Did it hurt to do that? [00:10:41] S4: Well, I'm kind of against the war, I just renounce it. And reality, because I lived in The UK for the last sixteen years. Business is in Europe, so it doesn't make sense for me to to to hold it. [00:10:52] S1: Okay. So but emotionally, did it hurt? [00:10:54] S4: Well, a little bit. Yeah. [00:10:56] S1: But... Yeah. Look, we talk about Revolut as being potentially a super app. I mean, it now does personal loans, it's credit cards, crypto trading, cash back shopping, and just this week you launched instant messaging. Are you trying to become a European super app? [00:11:12] S4: Well, ultimately, we want to have in one app all the financial services that our people use. I want to provide the services like in the simple, intuitive, and cost effective way for people.
00:11:12 · Nik Storonsky, Adrian Weckler
[00:11:12] S4: Well, ultimately, we want to have in one app all the financial services that our people use. I want to provide the services like in the simple, intuitive, and cost effective way for people. [00:11:23] S1: What do you think when you hear people talking about Revolut as being a potential super app? Mean, you now have instant messaging. [00:11:30] S4: Well, mean, super app is a very high level concept. Right? Ultimately, what it means for me super app is in one app, I can get access to everything what I need regarding my money. And that's... It's it's in a very simple way as well. Right? If I want to trade, can trade. If I want to buy, sell crypto, can do it. I can withdraw money. Can, you know, do effects. I can do transfers. I can borrow money. So for me just, you know, a tool where I can get everything what I need at good price. [00:11:57] S1: Would you ever consider expanding into services like mortgages for example? [00:12:02] S4: Yeah, definitely. At a certain point of time we will also do mortgages for consumers because when I look at all the mortgages processes, they're quite legacy as well. So it takes you know what seven days you know best. But then, you know, in the worst case it can take you, you know, one, two months to get the mortgage. [00:12:19] S1: In considering that, what kind of models would you look at? Like The States, they have things like rocket mortgages and models like that. Is there any model you're thinking of, if you were thinking of mortgages?
00:12:19 · Adrian Weckler, Nik Storonsky
[00:12:19] S1: In considering that, what kind of models would you look at? Like The States, they have things like rocket mortgages and models like that. Is there any model you're thinking of, if you were thinking of mortgages? [00:12:31] S4: I think it's it's gonna be two models. Right? The one is mortgage financed by us as a bank or or be like a mortgage introducer or it can be a combination. But ultimately what we want to build, we want to build a frictionless experience for people and a 100% digital. So can, you you know, within the app you apply for for the mortgage, you select the house that you want to buy and then you get it, you know, at the same time. Right? So everything is instant and automated. [00:12:56] S1: Now, I mentioned that Ireland is your second biggest market after The UK. Do you think you get a benefit still in Ireland from how poor the traditional Irish banks tech is? The apps, the user interface? [00:13:09] S4: Yeah, definitely. Obviously, know, one of the reasons why we're so popular in Ireland because you know banks are not good there. [00:13:14] S1: Yeah, yeah. I mean, if there's a lot of complaints if you open one of the leading banks apps on a tablet for example like this iPad, it's vertical and not horizontal, basic stuff like that. How much of a difference do you think ease of use and user interface makes when using an app of...
00:13:14 · Adrian Weckler, Nik Storonsky
[00:13:14] S1: Yeah, yeah. I mean, if there's a lot of complaints if you open one of the leading banks apps on a tablet for example like this iPad, it's vertical and not horizontal, basic stuff like that. How much of a difference do you think ease of use and user interface makes when using an app of... [00:13:30] S4: I think it's a massive, right? Because we we we got used to think about the bank as some kind of in a building where you go to get something what you want, but reality in the end banking is a software business, right? Everything should be automated and be provided instantly, efficiently and like autonomously from people. [00:13:49] S1: Now I know you're waiting on licenses in countries like The UK, Brazil, Australia, Mexico, I think The US as well. For now, are you happy that the Lithuanian license that you have is enough for a Europe wide financial services app? [00:14:06] S4: Yeah. For now, what we're done with Lithuania last, we actually branched out in every single country in Europe. That means we also regulated as a bank in every single country in Europe by a local regulator. So, you know, so far it's enough. [00:14:17] S1: And would you seek any other European licenses? I know you're waiting on a UK one. [00:14:23] S4: I mean, for for now we are not really working on it but, you know, maybe if things change, you know, we might. Mhmm. [00:14:29] S1: Now you sold an Irish license, and the Central Bank took thirty months sitting on it, and you walked away. Were you frustrated by that? Well, ultimately,
00:14:29 · Adrian Weckler, Nik Storonsky
[00:14:29] S1: Now you sold an Irish license, and the Central Bank took thirty months sitting on it, and you walked away. Were you frustrated by that? Well, ultimately, [00:14:41] S4: when we applied in Ireland, right, we applied for it for Brexit. Right? And because it wasn't ready in time for Brexit, we used our Lithuanian license. So then by the time Irish license was ready, already rolled out and branched out the bank out of Lithuania in every single country. And then we just, you know, thought, okay, what is beneficial for Irish customers? Obviously, you we can use Emania license Irish in Ireland for Irish customer, but then they don't have customer protection, and then they don't have access to all the pros that we have on on the bank. So it made sense to just to branch out the bank in Ireland. So it was more like cost benefit analysis for customers. [00:15:18] S1: Okay. Did that have any effect on plans for the Irish operation? Did you No. I mean, scale down? [00:15:25] S4: No. Really, we didn't because we we should transfer majority of people in Ireland to in the in the in bank. [00:15:30] S1: But in terms of the Irish office, think there's a 130 people employed. [00:15:34] S4: No, mean, majority of that they were transferred in the in the in bank. So if you look at our CEO for for the bank, he's actually used to be CEO for Ireland. Mhmm. [00:15:43] S1: And do you have any plans now for the Irish office? [00:15:48] S4: Plans? I mean, we were always hiring, you know, people. But in terms of licenses, I think in a way we we are set in Europe at the moment.
00:15:48 · Nik Storonsky, Adrian Weckler
[00:15:48] S4: Plans? I mean, we were always hiring, you know, people. But in terms of licenses, I think in a way we we are set in Europe at the moment. [00:15:55] S1: Now you've a new spend from crypto feature as well and I think you've doubled the number of crypto users in Ireland in the last year and I read that one in five Irish Revolut users actually trades How important is crypto to Revolut? Is it any more or less profitable than any other parts of the business? [00:16:15] S4: I mean, it used to be, you know, obviously very good last year. This year is a very small portion of our business. But I think as a product, it's still amazing. We're still kind of investing a lot of resources into, you know, building it, improving it. And then hopefully, you know, one day it will be a very large part of the financial system. [00:16:35] S1: Mhmm. Now I was in The US for the last two weeks and I was traveling with friends and when it came time to share bills, I asked them to Revolut me. Now neither of them had actually heard of Revolut but one of them actually downloaded the app and transferred money to me no problem. The other couldn't. It failed at the setup phase. How big of a challenge or an opportunity is The US for you? I mean, The US is huge bucket. Mean, obviously, [00:17:01] S4: we'll try as much as we can to win it. And then problem with The US is that it's it's also in a very fragmented in terms of states. And there are lot of banks in The US, so thousands and thousands of banks and also, you know, quite difficult to