00:49:46 · Dmitry Zlokazov
[00:49:46] S0: So I think there are those kind of table stakes that we're building that anyone would expect from a bank. Like, for example, savings account. Right? It's just a basic thing that if a bank is not providing savings account, you wouldn't even consider it. But then we make sure that our rates are very competitive, if not the best. Then we make sure that there is no bad UX. Like, you know, some banks, they, for example, they don't allow you to withdraw instantly, and there are delays, or they don't pay interest on daily basis. We will never do that. We will allow you if you want to move money out, you will be able to do it. You won't lose any interest. And interest is being paid daily, and this is a fully flexible product. And then on top of it, what I would call maybe some delighters is we will allow you to open the savings account in many currencies. So we want to add, like, different currencies. So... Because now interest rates are going down, so people might find it valuable to open a savings account in... For example, I know. In Europe, like Swedish krona, interest rates are higher than Europe, but it could be even something like Brazilian real or with, what, 12% interest rate versus, like, two or 3% on euros. And then as a cherry on top, there is this all all that in an amazing UI, very smooth. You can set custom wallpapers. You can set goals. You can automate spare change towards your savings account and and all those features. So there is an underlying basic fundamental layer where you need to be just on par with competition. But then there are a lot of things on top that just make people love your product way more. And, obviously, there are a lot of synergies in between those things. So, yeah, thinking of crypto, you can just receive crypto on your wallet, and then you can just instantly convert it to to cash on your account, or just spend it with your card. How amazing can it be, right, to to just buy a coffee with with Ethereum?
00:52:09 · Lenny Rachitsky
[00:52:09] S1: I love that. Okay. Let me take this opportunity to try to summarize what I've learned from you so far in terms of what you guys have figured out about creating incredible product leaders that go on to do wonderful things and basically one of the one of the top three most successful companies at this. So there's kind of these two buckets as I talk to you and the Palantir guy. There's kinda like the hiring piece, and then there's the... What you do to help incubate this kind of forge for incredible product leaders. So in the... What you do internally, kind of the four bullet points I've got here is give people a lot of ownership. They're essentially GMs of the product, the feature. There's a lot of focus on depth and complexity and getting really good at solving really gnarly problems. And then there's building... A focus on building wow products, amazing, lovable products that are very... That have a very high bar. And then there's kinda, like, a sub bullet point that I think is probably impactful here is just working closely with detail obsessed founders or product leaders like you and learning from you all and just, like, seeing the value and impact of being super detail oriented. On that bucket, is there anything else do you think is super core that I missed before we get to hiring?
00:53:21 · Dmitry Zlokazov, Lenny Rachitsky
[00:53:21] S0: Yeah. I would just maybe highlight the aspect of this, like, going deep into details. Right? It's it's... There there are two main streams. First is, let's say, being technical, understanding how underlying systems work. But second is also, you know, building empathy towards customers, understand their possible contexts, and making sure that your product will satisfy each one of them. [00:53:46] S1: That's a great point. So it's like actually understanding the bare metal of what is happening and how it's possible, and then making the experience as simple and wowable as possible. [00:53:55] S0: There is also a third aspect, but it's a boring one. And it's a... It's it's like complying with all possible regulations and making sure that your product, you know, will will satisfy the regulator. But it's also an important part of the of the job. [00:54:12] S1: Like, what I get from that is just building patience.
00:54:12 · Lenny Rachitsky, Dmitry Zlokazov
[00:54:12] S1: Like, what I get from that is just building patience. [00:54:17] S0: Would say I would say it's actually being able to to unblock your team, and that sometimes requires product owners to steamroll changes. Because it it also means that, you know, you could easily get stuck with a lot of people just looking into each other and think, okay, can they approve it? Can they not approve it? We try to innovate on it. We try to automate as many things as possible. We use even AI models for that. But it also requires a product owner to be able to to get things done, you know, to just just getting people down to to consensus and understanding who your stakeholders, how to get them to the necessary decision, and then blocking your team so that eventually, like, the value is shipped to to customers. [00:55:10] S1: Awesome. So essentially, it's just getting shit done, plowing through blockers, dealing with many stakeholders. [00:55:17] S0: Yeah. That's always the most important. [00:55:20] S1: Okay. That... That's a great addition. I could see why that would be really helpful for folks that are trying to get ahead in their career. Okay. And then on the hiring piece, what you look for is raw intellect, drive, hunger, passion, essentially. Those are the first two. And then interestingly, non senior, non... Not people with a ton of experience in the problem space, more so focusing on intellect and hunger. Is there anything else in that bucket that you think is important that leads to people being really successful?
00:55:20 · Lenny Rachitsky, Dmitry Zlokazov
[00:55:20] S1: Okay. That... That's a great addition. I could see why that would be really helpful for folks that are trying to get ahead in their career. Okay. And then on the hiring piece, what you look for is raw intellect, drive, hunger, passion, essentially. Those are the first two. And then interestingly, non senior, non... Not people with a ton of experience in the problem space, more so focusing on intellect and hunger. Is there anything else in that bucket that you think is important that leads to people being really successful? [00:55:49] S0: Most importantly, it's, again, getting things done, getting your hands dirty. And, you know, like, great product owners are very hands on. They don't think of themselves as managers who just give tasks to people and wait them to to complete it. They they just go and get things done, and they understand that most important things they will likely have to do themselves. And they understand that there needs to be relentless focus on execution. And if something is 99% done, it's closer to 0% rather than 100%. [00:56:29] S1: Woah. Say more there. Is the... Kind of the insight there is just like things seem like they're 99% done, but they're actually very far from being done? [00:56:37] S0: Like, sometimes the product is built, but then product owners are the ones who also, you know, make sure that, for example, customer care team or sales and marketing team are using it to a full extent. Right? Because without it, it could be just another useless feature which no... And no one knows about it.
00:56:37 · Dmitry Zlokazov, Lenny Rachitsky
[00:56:37] S0: Like, sometimes the product is built, but then product owners are the ones who also, you know, make sure that, for example, customer care team or sales and marketing team are using it to a full extent. Right? Because without it, it could be just another useless feature which no... And no one knows about it. [00:56:56] S1: That is super cool. I like that mentality. Let me ask you something completely different. What's kind of the story of you landing at Revolut? I know you had to move your family. It was a whole adventure.