00:35:04 · Erin Griffith, Ezra Klein, Max Read
[00:35:04] S4: What a world. [00:35:05] S2: The problem is that particularly with AI, although not only with AI, the question of do we want this is so salient. And for right now, for most people, the answer is, like, not under these conditions. Not if it's gonna do the thing you say it's gonna do. You person who is building it and profiting off of it and in control of it. And in that world, it's just, like, very hard to have a, like, a positive politics of technology because the technology is perceived, I think, very correctly and understandably as first and foremost a threat. You know, you go back to that o eight role they're talking about, and what tech means in politics is the Internet and social media, which is gonna collect... Connect everybody, and we're gonna have more friends, and we're gonna know about more things, [00:35:48] S4: and also energy. The economy from the recession. [00:35:51] S2: Gonna save the economy and and green energy. Right? [00:35:54] S1: Yeah.
00:35:54 · Max Read, Ezra Klein
[00:35:54] S1: Yeah. [00:35:54] S2: You know? And and right now, it's like it has all cohered around AI. And the AI story is just a much more mixed and frightening story for people at the moment. I don't think you're gonna have any politicians running saying, what we just need is way, way, way more AI. Think you'll have some saying there are things we can get from AI, you know, in terms of drug development and other... And and other domains, and we should encourage that. But, yeah, I mean, the problem with the tech industry is right now, they are all in, no pun intended, on something people increasingly don't think they want, and that's not a messaging problem. You know, I I just wrote a column about this the the other week. Max, you wrote about it, you know, with this idea of, like, on we risk. But even when you hear them talk about the world they're trying to get to, this world where human beings are the well kept pets of these superintelligent AIs, that world sucks. Mhmm. People don't want that world. That's not an inspiring vision. And so, like, there's a real... There's a... Not a messaging problem here. There's a there... Like, too many people in Silicon Valley are building towards a future that if it goes well, if you're not in the existential risk scenario, people don't want that future either where, you know, I got a seven and a five year old. It's completely unclear what it would mean to train them to have,
00:37:17 · Max Read, Erin Griffith, S0, S7
[00:37:17] S1: like, jobs. They're not gonna be prompt engineers? That doesn't seem to be... No longer seems to be a growth industry. Okay. We're gonna take a break. When we come back, we're gonna do a segment that... Okay. We're trying out a new name. We're gonna see how it plays. The new name is pacing the frontier, and we're all gonna take stories. This is really negative reaction so far. We're all gonna take stories. If you're not watching this on YouTube, I'm getting the the stoniest faces I could imagine. We're gonna we're gonna talk about stories that we are tracking ourselves that maybe other people aren't looking at that we think are gonna be important over the next few weeks, months, or years. This is Hard Fork. I'm with Erin Griffith and Ezra Klein. [00:37:55] S4: Wait. I thought you were gonna, like, announce a name for the segment. [00:37:58] S1: Pacing the frontier. [00:37:59] S4: I don't get it. [00:38:00] S1: I know. It doesn't really make sense, does it? Ad[00:38:12] S0: Weren't agents supposed to take things off your plate? Building another to handle the others is a bit much. Don't make more work out of work. Gemini is one agent that knows all parts of your business and actually gets stuff done. You give it a project, close your laptop, and when you come back, the job's finished. No matter your industry or role, your agent has the skills to help every team stay in their flow. Seriously, make work less work with Gemini on Google Cloud. Check response. Subscription required. Ad[00:38:43] S7: This podcast is supported by Chevron.
00:38:43 · S7, S6, S8, Max Read
Ad[00:38:43] S7: This podcast is supported by Chevron. Ad[00:38:46] S6: We rely on energy every day, whether it's the first cup of coffee in the morning, a flight home to family, or the lights that come on when you flip a switch. But have you ever wondered what it takes to make sure it's there when we need it? I'm Tanner Faust, and the energy tailgate is back with straight talk about the energy our lives and world depend on. No boardrooms, no jargon, just real conversations. This is the energy tailgate. New episodes available on Spotify and YouTube. Ad[00:39:16] S8: Today's AI builders need infrastructure that scales with their ambitions. IRen is a vertically integrated AI cloud platform delivering data centers, compute, and software for AI training and inference, underpinned by its expansive portfolio of land and grid connected power in renewable rich regions globally. IRen's AI cloud gives direct access to NVIDIA GPUs, scalable from hundreds to thousands. For builders, that means direct access to AI compute, rapid scaling, and predictable pricing. Erin, AI Cloud for the next big thing. [00:39:51] S1: Welcome back to Hard Fork. I'm here with Erin Griffith and Ezra Klein. We are doing a segment that before the break was called pacing the frontier and after the break is no longer called pacing the frontier. We're asking our guests about stories that they're tracking that we think are gonna be important over the next few weeks or months, but that nobody or not enough people are paying attention to right now. Erin, what did you bring to show and tell today?
00:40:11 · Erin Griffith
[00:40:11] S4: So there's a great story by our colleagues, Dana Goldstein and Natasha Singer, about Google announcing that it's going to turn off search, the the main thing we know Google for, for schools that don't wanna use their AI products. And this is notable to me because, I mean, Google is in many, many schools. Google Chromebooks are kind of the most used laptop in schools. And so kids are using Google Search for a lot. There's a lot of schools, including New York City schools, I believe, that don't want their kids to be exposed to or using AI. And Google is basically kind of saying, you don't want our AI? Well, fine. You don't get our search either, which is like such a classic tech industry move of like, I'm taking my ball and I'm going home because you don't like me. And, you know, Google had to come out and clarify and say, okay. Well, we're gonna figure out a way to kinda work through this. But, like, essentially, any schools that don't want AI also don't get Google search. And it's kind of... There... There's definitely a backlash to this, but it also, I think, speaks to this moment that we're in of schools and parents and everyone pushing away from tech in in schools and education. And, you know, Google is kind of kinda going in the other direction. So this story is, I think, something that's gonna continue and be something to watch.
00:41:31 · Max Read, Erin Griffith, Ezra Klein, Teddy Schleifer
[00:41:31] S1: Yeah. And it's a good story to talk about on this episode in particular because it feels like this is an issue that is going to weigh heavily on the electorate and politicians for the next two years. I mean, you know, speaking as a millennial parent, you know, I I I get the feeling that a top a issue for us voting millennial parents is going to be keeping AI the hell away from kids and education, and maybe away from kids entirely. And I think this kind of thing where the tech company doesn't seem to be listening exactly, You know, if you are a campaign manager somewhere or a chief of staff somewhere, you are gonna wanna stick your crowbar in and and and use your leverage to make it a big issue. [00:42:09] S4: I mean, I don't know why they don't just use DuckDuckGo. But [00:42:12] S1: I mean, I do think all classrooms should be very aware of surveillance and privacy issues. I'm happy to come and lecture at elementary schools about this stuff. Ezra, what story are you tracking this week? [00:42:21] S2: There's this permitting reform bill, [00:42:23] S3: and I